Who CAN'T be a Skrull?

captain america is not a scrull. it would end my world as I know it if he was

daredevil is to much of a hard a$$ to be taken over by a scrull.

iron fist.

ironman.

the rest of the inhumans.

sentry.

spider-man cause then he'll come back and have organic web shooters and identity won't be a secret.

I'm praying captain marvel.

and that's it. but does anyone get a bad feeling secret invasion's gonna flop?

Doc Nightmare is a Skrull

I think the skrulls are going to use to regestration act to their advantage

My personal suspicion is that we're going to see at least 1 skrull on all of the major teams throughout the Marvel U. A control agent if nothing else.

From the X-Men (even if they aren't heavilly involved, we'll probably have a little micro series Secret Invasion: X-Men like we did for Civil War): Emma is probably the most likely of the folks on the Astonishing team, and provides an in with all the X teams right now.

New Avengers: I'd go with Echo or Hawkeye as being the most obvious options. Echo's the least known of the characters, and Hawkeye's now back from the dead...

Mighty Avengers: Black Widow, she's so often distrusted and set aside from the rest of the team that it would have been doable to swap her out. Or, Wonderman.

Fantastic Four: Reed. He's the brains of the team, replacing him not only nets the Skrulls access to the FF's tech, but to misinformation to the rest of the marvel u.

Pym: Seems like a strong candidate, really for many of the same reasons as Reed Richards.

The suggestion of sleepers is probably a pretty good one, and would explain how the Skrulls would be able to so thoroughly get through the normal day to day existence of the characters.

Maybe:
Winter Soldier: Sure it was a long set up, but if Cap hadn't been killed, what better way to take him out of his game than to have his old partner suddenly back from the dead?
Maria Hill: Lots of potential for damage there.
Xavier: We don't have the turn into skrull when dead option to discount him as revealed in more recent X-Men books since the brotherhood stopped time and saved him. (dumb..but it's in there.)

Definately not:
Iron Man. Too easy to wuss out and claim it wasn't him, but a skrull the whole time.
Exodus. Too clueless to be of much use.

But, as much as we'd like to think that there might be some major heroes. We'll unfortunately have to see the Skrulls mostly being C and D level characters (like the new recruit in the Initiative instead of a known quantity) Maybe a major one here and there. (Black Bolt being one.) But mostly it'll probably be like in Civil War where most of the "A character will die!" were bottom rung ones. Goliath, and the two villans that Punisher killed for beating up Spiderman are three examples of this.

it was a new cadet. one that didn't get wasted by KIA.

the secret invasion would make a excuse for dead characters returning back, not to mention any names ... cough "steve rogers" cough

Is he the reveal as the skrull? I haven't picked up Initative in a couple months, if you don't want to put up a spoiler PM me somebody im PSyched to see what they do with Secret Invasion

I have to say the same thing. Hope we can debat again sometime.

Well we agree on the most important thing it seems... Henry Peter Gyrich is the most dangerous supervillain the world may yet ever see. He's worse than Doom any day. At least Doom has honor.

As for Stark, I'm sure he's not as bad as he seems, but boy oh boy he seems bad.

This thread has been fun. I'm glad I got a chance to take part in the discourse.

Heh. I love Shortpacked.



I suppose so, but still... Cap was supposedly his best friend. That was incredibly tacky and dishonorable of him imho.



I disagree. There has got to be a better way. Use of the Weapon as it's been used thus far is pure fascist.



So she saw the error of her ways only when it affected her personally. That makes her selfish, but it doesn't make her wrong in her accusation to Tony.



Which is why I think Stark is a Skrull. I don't believe he was a skrull at that point, though.



Oh come on... Stark was the driving force behind the SRA from the moment Stamford happened. He wasn't handed the responsibility of the SRA... he drove it to the bank.



It was as you say, but it still gives you things to think about.

You didn't respond to the bit I wrote about how it may have gone differently had Hill not overreacted and attacked Cap as soon as he questioned the Act... I'm curious what you thought of that.

Yeah, Shortpacked is great.

What he said about Captain America was horrible and a blatent lie, no question about it. I'm not advocating the Depowering Weapon, I'm just saying that it would come into play eventually. If it wasn't SHEILD it would have been Doom, if it hadn't been Doom, it would have been Apocolyps, if it hadn't Apocolyps it would have been it would have been...Kang? My point is, eventually supervillain would figure out how to strip a person of their powers and render them almost harmless.

What Jennifer said may be true, but coming from her, it rings hollow to me.

It is a vaild point you make in regards to Stark and the SRA, but Stark reilized that he could not talk them out of passing the law, so he asked them to put him in charge of it out of fear that they may cause more harm than good if the goverment was in full control of the Superheroes. He endoresed and enforced the law so that the Goverment wouldn't send out juiced up Sentinals or what have you to take out all powers, unfourtunaly over the course of the Civil War, Tony became disillusioned by his formers allies actions and grew increasingly hostile and borderline pychotice in the act of trying to "save" the hero comunity and the world.

I completly forgot about the whole Hill thing when I was writting my response!:lol: Hill's actions where in character as an anti-superhero fanatic that would take any opportunity to put the kibash on a cape. Commander Hill should be promtly tried and convicted for unprovoked assault and tresion as her actions sparked a cataclismc battle that nearly tore the USA apart. She is just as responsible for the events of Civil War, and Captain America's murder as Nitro and Tony Stark...Isn't Gyrich essentially Robert Kelly reborn except more, ALL THE POWER FOR ME!

Emma a Skrull? nah, the X-Men are so divorced from the rest of the Marvel U I don't see them being major players in the Secret Invasion - they're too busy trying to breed mutant babies and fight off Dark Phoenix every other year.

I was thinking that Pym might be one. guess he doesn't die in Avengers: Initiative since he's pictured with Iron Man and Mr Fantastic in the preview of Secret Invasion 1.

as for the Pym / Tigra tryst - I don't think Skrulls would be doing the nasty with any Earthlings cuz they hate 'em so much. go read the Avengers: Kree - Skrull War - it'll show you how much Skrulls hate.

and there was a Skrull reveal in the last issue of Avengers: Initiative.

as for Tony Stark - he's not evil, he's just got a tough job to do with a bad situation and he's trying to do it the best way possible. and he's being portrayed very realistically - he's not perfect, he's flawed just like all humans are. he makes good and bad decisions but he's trying to do what he thinks is right.

and one of the main reasons he got behind the SRA was because he foresaw the possibility of the government using Sentinels and other weapons to hunt down and terminate all superpowereds if they didn't get in line and sign up. he's trying to keep the situation from becoming a bloodbath. plus every chance he gets he offers amnesty to unregistereds. I think you're selling him short Punstarr. don't throw Tony under a bus - he's a good guy deep down inside and I will bet he'll end up being the hero of the day at the end of the Secret Invasion.

Heh. I love Shortpacked.



I suppose so, but still... Cap was supposedly his best friend. That was incredibly tacky and dishonorable of him imho.



I disagree. There has got to be a better way. Use of the Weapon as it's been used thus far is pure fascist.



So she saw the error of her ways only when it affected her personally. That makes her selfish, but it doesn't make her wrong in her accusation to Tony.



Which is why I think Stark is a Skrull. I don't believe he was a skrull at that point, though.



Oh come on... Stark was the driving force behind the SRA from the moment Stamford happened. He wasn't handed the responsibility of the SRA... he drove it to the bank.



It was as you say, but it still gives you things to think about.

You didn't respond to the bit I wrote about how it may have gone differently had Hill not overreacted and attacked Cap as soon as he questioned the Act... I'm curious what you thought of that.

Back to the Skrulls. Pym I thinks be a skrull, Storm I thinks be a skrull, White Queen I thinks be a skrull. and heres my reasons.
Pym: Hank has always wanted Wasp, never have I seen her go anywhere else but hes gettin Cozy with Tigra? and hows about how hes actin in the INT. He wouldn't have covered up MVPs death.
Storm: Who better to Subjagate a major player in the world but the Queen of Wakanda.
And WEll Emma has been just weird. I can understand the second mutation thing Beast turned into a cat, iceman turned into ice Angel got healing abilitiesokay that ones a streatch> But Emma Frost turns into a F***in diamond? how does that make sense?

I don't agree with the SRA at all, the choice for putting on the tights should be yours. But it Seems that you do have a choice to be used in field missions look at Firestar in frontline she threw her mask off and said I won;t do it. But she was already registerd. With the exception of the T-bolts who don't have any other choice that Prison they are fair to whom they use in missions.

What Tony said about Cap to the Daily Bugle was a classic political manuver. Think about, who's name do Republican's envoke everytime someone tries to pass a law that they don't like? Reggan! Reggan wouldn't want this, Reggan wouldn't want that. I swear sometimes it seems like they want to dig up his corpse and have sex with it! Tony is now a politician, which throws him down a rung of the Evolutinary Ladder in my opinion, and will use any tatic to get his poll ratings up.

The Weapon was really neccasary if you want to control Superhuman's, barbaric as it is, so it was bound to come into excistant in the Marvel U. eventually.

The use of the Thunderbolts, the N. Zone Prison, amnysty for convicted Mass Murderers and Serial Killers is a dispecable act and can not be excused.

When he covered up the accidental death of MVP is not something that is uncommon in the real world. Many soliders that have been killed by friendly fire are often changed to being killed by an enemy to avoid a spot on the military's record. However, both acts are disgraceful.

The murder of the Atlantian's is still unclear wheather they where insergents as Iron Man claims or reashearchers as Namor says. Given Tony's actions and Namor's intense distrust of the Surface World, both possibility's are equal valid, until you factor in the Green Goblins attack on the Atlantian delaget with a cheap hand gun when Norman was unable to act on his own for fear of being rendered catatonic strongly implys that he was ordered to do so by Tony. This was adressed in Civil War Front Line. I agree with you on this part whole heartedly.

What Jennifer said to Tony was very biased when you consider what she learned of what he did to her cousin, whom she loves deeply. If you think of her actions during the Civil War, you find that she is just as agressive and hostile to Speed Ball and other Unregistered Heroes saying that she would make sure that they where locked up for the rest of their lives if they didn't conform to the law.

The reasoning behind the license for a gun and car is completly inimitable. Like you said, owning a car and gun a optional for a person, having superpowers, either through genetics or accident is that is forced upon a person who usually doesn't want these abilities. Saying you need a license for something you never wanted nore asked for is idiotic.

The SRA didn't originate because of the Stanford Incedent, but had been in the works for years due to the actions of the heroes and villains which resulted in lose of life and high property damage, especially in the case of the Hulk, who's rampage through Las Vegas prior to the Standford Incedent brought the SRA to the forfront of Congress, but it was Iron Man himself that opposed the act and was able to talk Congress out of it until the Stanford Incedent.

It my have been the power that Stark was handed, combined with the task of fighting those he considered friends, a luxurery for a person like Stark who is notable paranoid and constently under heavy stress, that drove this hero to actions that are far from heroic.

What you need to understand about Civil War was that it was a tool used by Marvel to have a huge political debate that was completly one sided, regardless of the harm to the characters. Both Tony and Captain America where handled poorly above all others for the fact that they acted as the mouth pieces for the indivdual writters to scream at each other and us that they where right, and everyone that disagreed with them was a fascist Nazi insted of adding subtle political alogories to a storyline in a clever and intellegent way.

yep, I agree with all that Collector1. good points all.

Gyrich is a d!ck. has been since they first introduced him in The Avengers back in the late 70's / early 80's.

She Hulk found out about what Tony did to her cousin and confronted him about it. He responded by sucker punching her with a repulser beam blast and finally injecting her with an Adamantium dart full of nanites that stripped her of her powers.

My thoughts on the SRA? I'll paste what I said on another site.

What I thought was the worst part of the whole Civil War thing was how they approached Cap in the first place. I'll admit that perhaps Cap went about standing up for what he believed in the wrong way... he should have rallied others in the country to repeal the law via protest and well spoken debate, instead of through violence. However, Commander Hill likewise should not have reacted as she did (siccing a squad of tastelessly named "cape killers" on Cap for simply saying no). If Cap is to blame for instigating the violent protest, the catechumenal incompetence of Miss Hill should be held just as accountable.

The main problem with people's reasoning for the SRA's existence is that it tends to be "well, you have to have a license to own a gun or drive a car", not taking into account that you can choose whether or not you want to own a gun or a car... innate superpowered individuals don't have that option. Finally, the fact that the SRA is coming into being directly because of a single tragedy (in terms of public support) is straight up piss poor reasoning. It's as Strange said, giving in to people's fears and ignorance... it's why garbage like the Patriot Act got passed in the wake of 9/11.

This is why I feel as I do. The SRA is a potentially good idea implemented terribly in nearly every way. It makes the conformists look like government tools and turns heroes into criminals. Look at all of Tony's poor decisions...

*Deciding to use convicted murderers and criminals as superpowered agents behind the public's back.

*Using said agents to murder Atlanteans in order to cultivate public distrust of Namor and Atlantis.

*Using said agents to permanently disable heroes who refuse to register with the SRA.

*Hunting down heroes who disobey this law and imprisoning them in one of the worst, most atrocious prisons the world has ever seen. Since the prison is not on US soil, US laws regarding ethical treatment of prisoners don't apply. The extradimensional nature of this prison also by it's very nature cultivates despair and misery.

*Blatantly speaking for Cap after his death in the Daily Bugle. "Even Captain America in the end saw how just the SRA is, he saw the error of his ways", or somesuch. Bull. Cap felt the SRA was wrong to the bitter end. That was incredibly tacky of Tony.

*Covering up MVP's accidental death at the Stamford training camp.

*Developing new weaponry specifically designed to rob superhumans of their powers with the intent of using this tech on anyone that stands in his way, even friends like She Hulk (How dare she question the great Tony Stark, after all).

Jennifer said what I think are the truest words yet spoken to Tony since Civil War ended... "You really don't see it, do you? A tin plated tyrant obsessed with reshaping the world in his own image and ruthlessly crushing anyone who opposes him... that's not Iron Man, Tony... that's Doctor Doom"!

My thoughts excatly! Though, my reasons for being against the SRA is a little different. What truly drove home the massive negative points of the SRA was an essay by one Madgoblin that he posted on his website, http://www.spideykicksbutt.com.

The SRA requires ALL superhuman's, not just superheroes but regular citizens that happen to have superpowers. Hopefully comic fan recognize that this merely the MRA reworded and expanded. What if you have superpowers but don't want to be a herp/villain. What if you just want to be an accountant, just one that has superpowers. Well, that dreams shot down as you have now been drafted by SHEILD because if you resist, well say hello to the Negative Zone!

You are now a Goverment Dog at the beck and call of your political masters. So you do the forced Hero gig for twenty, thirty years but now your bones hurt. Your visions going a little south and you're just plain tired of putting on a pair of spandex tights and galavanting around the city and the world to take out the Nations "Enemies".

Do they give you a nice shiny gold pocket watch and send you to live the rest of your days on a sunny beach surrounded by loose hulagirls? What if the goverment decided that someone with your powers isn't safe to be walking around without his leash on? You end up with a bullet in your brain.

Not only is the SRA an encrochment on Civil Liberty's, but also is a death warrent for every person that has powers. Not to mention what the Goverment would do with a trained army of literal Super Soliders at their disposal.

What you said about Grynch is very true. One of the What If?...Civil War story's had Iron Man dieing before the Civil War incident which cumulated in Grynch in charge of the SRA and having an army of Clores which effectivly killed every superhuman on Earth. Grynch is a man of flexibale morals and a completly self serving, selfrightous personality. Giving someone like him that power is truly horrorfying.

no I didn't see what Stark did to She-Hulk. I'm just going off what I read in Civil War, Captain America, the Iron Man CW TPB collection and the Avengers titles.

I'm against the SRA. to have superpowered beings regulated and controlled by politicians would be so wrong - talk about WMDs in the hands of the wrong people. Gyrich in Avengers: Initiative is the perfect example of how it can go bad.

but I also see what Marvel is doing here - they're trying to show both sides of the coin and paint a realistic picture - the world is not all black and white, there are many shades of gray.

So does Stark. Remember what he did to She Hulk when she dared to question him?

I take it you are pro SRA then, Buzzy? Just out of curiosity so I can understand your standpoint.

let's not mix up a dictator whose will is law regardless of the majority's will with a man hired to enforce a law that is the will of the majority.

Stark isn't evil - he has a tough and thankless job that he has been given to do and he is doing his best to accomplish the task even though it has put him on the outs with many of his friends. and remember the Registration Act wasn't his idea - it was the politician's working for the "welfare" of the people. Stark just happens to agree with the positive aspects of it and is trying to make sure it's not twisted up by politicians that put their own personal agendas above the welfare of their constituents.

Doom violently squashes any opposition to his power. like Hitler and Stalin.

You raise a valid point. Dr. Doom can not be classified as a straight up villain, akin too Magneto and the Modern Era Lex Luthor. While his actions are often violent and cause much death, it was shown that on an alternate Earth that Dr. Doom had conquered, the world was launched into an era of peace and prosparity for all but to acheive this, he had to crush the rights and freedoms of The People, therfore he can not be allowed to rule the world.

One example of how Tony is a little bit better than Doom, has he ever atomized his personal orchastra for not completing the Minute Waltz in one minute which is nearly impossible has the waltz last somewhere between one and a half to two minutes.

I see what you're saying, but think on this... Doctor Doom honestly thinks that his actions are for the world's own good as well. He genuinely thinks that by ruling the world he'd bring about everlasting peace under his iron fist. Yet no one questions that Doom is evil. Stark has acted no better than Doom at his worst of late.

I don't think it's fair to call Tony evil. While his characterizations have been all over the place in recent years, something I mode note of on the OND/BND thread, he genuanly beleives that he is doing what is best for the world even if he has to cross the line of morality. Don't get me wrong, I do not approve of Tony Stark, Henry Pym, and Reed Richard's actions of late as they are truly hanus and at times, inhuman.

There actions are more forced by the writters own political leaning's and beating us over the head that they're opinons are the "Truth".

What Stark and his associates have done is nothing short of criminal and they should be punished for their actions.

By the way, please give your reasons for saying why so-and-so isn't a Skrull for all future posters.

It'd be lame as all getout if he were a Skrull (a lame excuse), but I can think of little other reasoning behind Stark's evil.

Captain Marvel

Daredevil

Iron Fist (depending on when the story in his current book is taking place)

New Captain America

The Punisher

could it be that some Skrulls are sleepers? hypnotized to believe and act like the person they are posing as until the Skrull command activates them? devious.

but then this is Marvel - anyone could be a Skrull no matter how impossible it would be according to previous plots, Marvel doesn't sweat the little things like continuity or how believable a plot twist is.